Dec. 31, 2025

Ben Wolff of Onera & Oasi: What It Takes To Sell Your Property To A Public REIT

Ben Wolff of Onera & Oasi: What It Takes To Sell Your Property To A Public REIT

Send us a text We chart how Ben Wolff scaled from short-term rentals to design-led outdoor resorts, sold into a public REIT, built a content-first marketing firm, and now launches a wellness agritourism brand near Miami called Baya. Clear tactics on funding, pricing, direct bookings and the partners that make it work. • founder-level partners who own execution and upside • debt and equity strategies across banks, CPACE, USDA and VCs • influencer barbell strategy and content-first marketing •...

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Send us a text

We chart how Ben Wolff scaled from short-term rentals to design-led outdoor resorts, sold into a public REIT, built a content-first marketing firm, and now launches a wellness agritourism brand near Miami called Baya. Clear tactics on funding, pricing, direct bookings and the partners that make it work.

• founder-level partners who own execution and upside
• debt and equity strategies across banks, CPACE, USDA and VCs
• influencer barbell strategy and content-first marketing
• 80 to 85% direct bookings as the North Star
• manual revenue management beyond algorithm defaults
• Onera’s sale, expansion and Wimberley performance
• Oasi’s offer, ROAS mindset and client profile
• Baya concept blending farm, wellness and jungle design
• light, health-forward F&B and sleep technology
• daily routines, AI workflows and energy management
• singles and doubles until capital markets open

Subscribe to Ben Wolff's newsletter via LinkedIn or Ben's instagram @IAm BenWolff.

Onera Fredericksburg and Wimberly Property Websites 

Oasi Marketing & Advertising Website

Newbook - www.newbook.cloud

Interested in learning more about Newbook? Book a software demonstration with one of their market consultants today and don't forget to mention you came from the Outdoor Hospitality Podcast to receive 15% off your Newbook subscription and your first month free. This offer is for Newbook Signature subscriptions only.

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We work hard to bring you the best insights from top experts in this space- FREE OF CHARGE, all we ask is that you consider leaving us a positive review so we can keep the momentum growing. To leave a review go to the podcast home page and scroll down past some of the first episodes - we appreciate you!

00:00 - Meet Ben Wolf And His Playbook

02:45 - The Power Of Founder-Level Partners

06:30 - Capital, Debt And Getting To Yes

09:12 - Sponsor: Newbook PMS

09:45 - From STR Arbitrage To Onera

13:05 - Influencers That Actually Move Bookings

15:20 - Sponsor: Clockwork Architecture

16:00 - OTAs Versus Direct: The Ratio That Works

19:30 - Build In Public And Win On Social

23:10 - Onera’s Growth, Sale And Expansion

27:35 - Wimberley Performance And Targets

28:42 - Awasi: Content First, Revenue Obsessed

33:20 - Pricing Beyond Algorithms

36:40 - Who Awasi Serves And How

40:10 - Marketing Budgets That Replace OTA Fees

44:05 - Sponsor: Sage Outdoor Advisory

44:30 - Baya: Farm, Wellness And Jungle Vibes

49:20 - Sleep Tech, Hydrotherapy And Design

52:30 - F&B That Fits A 20-Key Resort

55:30 - Modular Units And Timeline

57:20 - AI For Content, Research And Workflow

01:02:10 - Habits, Health And Entrepreneur Routines

WEBVTT

00:00:02.080 --> 00:00:04.799
Welcome back to the Outdoor Hospitality Podcast.

00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:06.559
I'm your host, Connor Schwab.

00:00:06.559 --> 00:00:09.279
Today we have special guest on the show, Ben Wolf.

00:00:09.279 --> 00:00:09.839
Welcome, Ben.

00:00:09.839 --> 00:00:10.640
Thanks, Connor.

00:00:10.640 --> 00:00:11.599
Great to be here again.

00:00:11.599 --> 00:00:12.560
Yeah, of course.

00:00:12.560 --> 00:00:17.359
And just a little bit of an intro on Ben, if you're not familiar, hopefully you are with his background at this point.

00:00:17.359 --> 00:00:33.520
But if you're not, he's the founder of ONERA, which started in Fredericksburg, which eventually is basically a unique stay in landscape resort style development, which sold to Summit REIT in 2022, which was one of the first public REITs of its kind.

00:00:33.520 --> 00:00:39.039
And then he opened O'Nera's second location in Wingberly, which was much larger, and I've had a chance to visit personally.

00:00:39.039 --> 00:00:42.719
It's beautiful in 2024, and that's 23 keys.

00:00:42.719 --> 00:00:45.280
And we'll get an update on how that's been going.

00:00:45.280 --> 00:01:00.159
And then he is the CEO and founder of Awassi, which is essentially a third-party marketing and advertising and research firm for unique and outdoor hospitality hotel operations, uh, which is excellent.

00:01:00.159 --> 00:01:03.439
So he definitely knows his stuff in terms of marketing and advertising.

00:01:03.439 --> 00:01:10.000
And then he's also working on his newest development, which is Baya, which we are excited to dive into as well.

00:01:10.000 --> 00:01:12.079
So yeah, quite the long pedigree.

00:01:12.079 --> 00:01:13.760
But yeah, Ben, how how are you?

00:01:14.079 --> 00:01:14.719
I'm good, man.

00:01:14.719 --> 00:01:15.040
Yeah.

00:01:15.040 --> 00:01:18.959
When you read off that list, it just reminds me, you know, certainly how busy it is.

00:01:18.959 --> 00:01:22.159
But we I've got some amazing partners today.

00:01:22.159 --> 00:01:27.599
And so that's kind of what is allowing me to do all these things at a high level, which is really cool.

00:01:27.599 --> 00:01:28.959
And it was not always that way.

00:01:28.959 --> 00:01:32.719
I feel, you know, I've I've developed those and cultivated those relationships and partnerships over time.

00:01:33.040 --> 00:01:41.280
What is the most key personnel to have to do what you do, to enable you to focus on what you do best and like have this growth and the success?

00:01:41.599 --> 00:01:56.239
It depends on which area of the business, but I would say in general, to be building multiple enterprises at once, you need true founder level 100 or 1000 X employees, really partners, right?

00:01:56.239 --> 00:02:01.680
Not employees that have materially material equity and upside in what you're building.

00:02:01.680 --> 00:02:05.840
So I have that in each, you know, each of the things that I'm really focused on right now.

00:02:05.840 --> 00:02:10.080
So both AWASI and Baya, um, I have that, even on Air to some extent as well.

00:02:10.080 --> 00:02:19.840
I have partners that have a big piece of the pie, a huge incentive, and they are people that I've known for years, kind of vetted for years.

00:02:19.840 --> 00:02:23.680
Um, I've seen their execution and ability firsthand.

00:02:23.680 --> 00:02:31.680
And, you know, I just know that they can, you know, they can 100, 1,000 X themselves and stand up entirely new business lines.

00:02:31.680 --> 00:02:33.759
Like those types of partners are the people that I need.

00:02:34.080 --> 00:02:40.639
And are these folks coming in who are investing or just bringing equity to the development of these projects, or are they helping strategically?

00:02:40.639 --> 00:02:41.599
What do you mean?

00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:42.240
Yeah.

00:02:42.240 --> 00:02:45.039
So when I say partners, I'm not talking about LPs.

00:02:45.039 --> 00:02:47.840
I mean, our LPs are great and I can talk at length about them as well.

00:02:47.840 --> 00:02:49.280
I'm talking about true partners.

00:02:49.280 --> 00:02:55.520
So in Baya, my partners are Steve Turk, who you probably know, who's has a podcast himself called the Hospitality Mentor.

00:02:55.520 --> 00:02:56.719
That's actually how I met him.

00:02:56.719 --> 00:03:01.680
Um, he's been doing the LinkedIn personal brand game in hospitality for much longer than I have.

00:03:01.680 --> 00:03:03.039
He's got a bigger following there.

00:03:03.039 --> 00:03:08.960
And he has been in luxury hospitality at the executive level for decades.

00:03:08.960 --> 00:03:18.159
So he's been, you know, number two in command, I think, at Lowe's Hotel, which is a $300 million a year hotel, similar FB director at Nobu Hotel, amongst others.

00:03:18.159 --> 00:03:30.479
And so, and oh, by the way, he actually had the first location for Baya on lock via a family friend that we got a very attractive 99-year lease on due to his relationship largely.

00:03:30.479 --> 00:03:38.960
So, like that kind of partner, right, is is kind of what I, you know, what I need to be able to do multiple of these types of businesses well.

00:03:38.960 --> 00:03:59.280
Um, and then in addition to Steve, we've got Banks Chisholm, who you know, the founder principal of JB Chisholm, who was the builder on and really did a lot of some of the entitlement and development work on the last two Onera builds, helped us come in on time, on budget, you know, broke his and his team's backs to make sure that we did no matter what.

00:03:59.280 --> 00:04:04.719
And really through the experience of working with him, I'm like, I don't ever want to work with another GC or construction person.

00:04:04.719 --> 00:04:08.960
So brought him in as a basically a full equal partner on the bio project.

00:04:08.960 --> 00:04:18.879
So it's like those kind of partners that I need to be able to focus on vision, concept, you know, future strategy, personal brand, getting the message out there, communicating the vision.

00:04:19.199 --> 00:04:23.120
Your projects coming in on time and on budget.

00:04:23.120 --> 00:04:26.000
You don't hear that very often in the last five years.

00:04:26.000 --> 00:04:29.199
Uh I've had a chance to get to know banks.

00:04:29.199 --> 00:04:32.959
And I he's just the type of guy who I trust completely.

00:04:32.959 --> 00:04:39.439
Uh, you know, having not spent hardly any time with him, uh, he just builds that trust quite quickly and he definitely seems like he knows his stuff.

00:04:39.759 --> 00:04:48.399
And yeah, and look, he he is exceptionally good at gaining trust, which can be dangerous if if you're not, you know, if you don't treat that with care, but he really does, right?

00:04:48.399 --> 00:04:50.160
He he lives up to the billing.

00:04:50.160 --> 00:05:04.240
He is, you know, yes, he he earns trust and gains trust very quickly, I feel like, because he's so competent, but he just does an amazing stand-up job and and you know, has always been willing to take an L where necessary to make sure, you know, for the good of the project.

00:05:04.240 --> 00:05:05.600
And and that's what we need on the team.

00:05:05.600 --> 00:05:07.600
Like I have, he has, we all have, right?

00:05:07.839 --> 00:05:08.160
Yeah.

00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:09.920
Development in your GC.

00:05:09.920 --> 00:05:20.959
I mean, that's what I expected you to say, you know, because that's to me, that just seems to be the part where where these projects, that's where I see projects get tripped up the most is going through the development and and the construction.

00:05:20.959 --> 00:05:23.199
And yeah, so that's that's amazing.

00:05:23.199 --> 00:05:27.040
Any other like really key personnel to get a project done successfully?

00:05:27.600 --> 00:05:27.920
Yeah.

00:05:27.920 --> 00:05:36.079
So from the development side, you need obviously construction, development experience, and somebody who's a rock star.

00:05:36.079 --> 00:05:41.600
If that's not you, like you need a, I feel like a partner, whether that's a partner for hire or a true equity partner.

00:05:41.600 --> 00:05:48.000
And then I would say, I mean, you really need an amazing capital markets and you know, capital raising person.

00:05:48.000 --> 00:05:52.160
And that that you know, that happens to be me, by and large, for a lot of these projects.

00:05:52.160 --> 00:05:57.120
I mean, banks helps quite a bit with the debt side, I would say, less so the equity.

00:05:57.120 --> 00:06:07.040
And I have probably uh uh I've done more conventional, I've done less conventional, like more leveraging my personal brand, which is becoming more common to raise equity capital.

00:06:07.040 --> 00:06:20.240
And, you know, I always have to talk to a zillion, you know, lenders of different types, you know, government-backed programs like CPACE and USDA and SBA and local community banks and you know, private specialty hotel lenders.

00:06:20.240 --> 00:06:25.839
Like we always have to talk to so many different people on the debt side for every project because what we do is so unique.

00:06:25.839 --> 00:06:27.920
And typically lenders have their checklist.

00:06:27.920 --> 00:06:31.279
And if we're not fitting exactly within it, it doesn't work.

00:06:31.279 --> 00:06:36.160
So you need a great capital markets person, both on the equity and the debt side and the construction portion.

00:06:36.160 --> 00:06:39.439
And then, I mean, of course, you need a good concept, vision, and product.

00:06:39.439 --> 00:06:45.360
So I'd say those are probably the three most crucial components to get something built really well.

00:06:45.360 --> 00:06:48.079
And then, I mean, you need a great operator, marketer, all the rest.

00:06:48.079 --> 00:06:58.160
But in order to get to the phase of opening and at least setting yourself up for success, I would say construction development, capital markets, which includes investors and product.

00:06:58.480 --> 00:06:59.360
Hello, listeners.

00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:01.040
I wanted to share a quick story.

00:07:01.040 --> 00:07:07.920
I recently started to help a client set up their three properties, two RV resorts and one glamping resort.

00:07:07.920 --> 00:07:11.600
And they wanted me to help roll out their new tech stack.

00:07:11.600 --> 00:07:14.959
And at the center of that is the PMS or the property management software.

00:07:14.959 --> 00:07:27.920
These clients decided to go with storable new book, and thank goodness they did because the property management software is the nucleus of everything that you'll set up your website, your social media, your bookings, your cleanings, everything.

00:07:27.920 --> 00:07:35.680
And it really handles the entire process from both the front customer facing side as well as the back end and coordinating cleaners and things like that.

00:07:35.680 --> 00:07:51.279
So it's, you know, setting up your photos and your pricing and your dynamic pricing and revenue management and your unit information and ensuring a smooth and customizable shopping cart experience to ensure a high conversion rate with your customers.

00:07:51.279 --> 00:07:53.279
And then they have all these great automations.

00:07:53.279 --> 00:08:02.319
It can send texts and emails to your guests before they arrive, on the day they arrived or after to get feedback and reviews, and you can track all your financial performance.

00:08:02.319 --> 00:08:05.839
And then it also helps with the back end and analyzing your data.

00:08:05.839 --> 00:08:08.480
I honestly couldn't be happier with the experience.

00:08:08.480 --> 00:08:19.839
If I called the New Book helpline, I get an answer right away with someone who can help me with like three or four standing meetings each week with different members of their teams to set up the different capabilities and softwares.

00:08:19.839 --> 00:08:25.439
We're even using them to set up these property websites, we're using them for digital marketing services and SEO.

00:08:25.439 --> 00:08:28.000
And honestly, it has been excellent.

00:08:28.000 --> 00:08:35.039
I saw I chased down storable new book to ask them if they would be sponsors of the podcast because I really believed in their product.

00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:36.720
Fortunately, they were willing.

00:08:36.720 --> 00:08:38.399
So they are today's sponsors.

00:08:38.399 --> 00:08:44.799
So if you're unhappy with your PMS or you're launching a product and shopping, definitely give them a call.

00:08:44.799 --> 00:08:46.799
They'll give you a free software demonstration.

00:08:46.799 --> 00:08:54.480
And if you let them know that you came from the Outdoor Hospitality Podcast, they'll give you 15% off your new book signature subscriptions.

00:08:54.480 --> 00:08:57.279
Can't recommend storable new book highly enough.

00:08:57.279 --> 00:08:58.080
Go check them out.

00:08:58.080 --> 00:08:58.639
Thanks.

00:08:58.639 --> 00:09:02.639
What was your strategy around fundraising in the beginning?

00:09:02.639 --> 00:09:08.480
Like before you had these, you know, brands and successful projects and followings and things like that.

00:09:08.480 --> 00:09:11.039
How how did you get your first project funded?

00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:12.240
What did that look like?

00:09:12.559 --> 00:09:16.159
The first O'Nero project, ground up, it was a very unique time.

00:09:16.159 --> 00:09:18.879
So I will caveat all of this by saying that.

00:09:18.879 --> 00:09:21.759
It was late 2020, early 21.

00:09:21.759 --> 00:09:23.919
Rates were effectively at zero.

00:09:23.919 --> 00:09:25.840
Everybody is chasing yield.

00:09:25.840 --> 00:09:28.720
So it was one of the easiest times to raise money ever.

00:09:28.720 --> 00:09:33.120
So I do have to caveat it with saying that it was very easy to raise money.

00:09:33.120 --> 00:09:37.840
With that said, I had a really good track record with the people that I went to.

00:09:37.840 --> 00:09:40.159
So I had a short-term rental management company.

00:09:40.159 --> 00:09:44.159
And the first people that I went to were people that we managed for their short-term rentals.

00:09:44.159 --> 00:09:46.720
And then I had made money, I had garnered their trust.

00:09:46.720 --> 00:09:49.919
They saw me as a responsible operator and they trusted me.

00:09:49.919 --> 00:10:05.679
So I went to all those people, took a couple, you know, one or two phone calls apiece, and we had checks between 50 and you know 200 grand from each of them, which allowed us to raise, you know, the 800K to a million dollars we needed in equity for the first phase of that project.

00:10:05.679 --> 00:10:08.000
So that's how it happened the first time.

00:10:08.000 --> 00:10:13.440
I will say that it's never been that easy again, which is counterintuitive because I have more of a track record today.

00:10:13.440 --> 00:10:18.559
And it's actually been harder to raise money, largely, I think, because of the economic environment.

00:10:18.559 --> 00:10:24.159
And for those of you out there who are trying to get these projects done and built, like it is hard.

00:10:24.159 --> 00:10:25.600
It's even hard for me, right?

00:10:25.600 --> 00:10:29.200
And I've done this now a couple of times over and have a strong track record.

00:10:29.200 --> 00:10:42.799
But if you, if you leverage your friends and family network, if you build up a personal brand and leverage that, if you, you know, spend the time that it takes to develop relationships with family offices or institutional partners, like you will ultimately get there.

00:10:42.799 --> 00:10:46.559
It's just, it just takes time and it takes a lot of no's and you got to have thick skin.

00:10:46.879 --> 00:10:53.759
Could you maybe just give the high level of like the O'Neill journey with the first location, the second location, you know, and and where they're at today?

00:10:54.000 --> 00:10:55.120
Yeah, happy to.

00:10:55.120 --> 00:10:58.639
So I started in more commodity Airbnb world, right?

00:10:58.639 --> 00:11:01.519
That was the start of my real estate hospitality journey.

00:11:01.519 --> 00:11:08.240
And I quit my full-time software sales job early 2018 to really go all in on hospitality real estate.

00:11:08.240 --> 00:11:11.440
And at that time, it was specifically Airbnb, short-term rentals.

00:11:11.440 --> 00:11:14.399
And it was mostly lease arbitrage, right?

00:11:14.399 --> 00:11:19.600
So we were leasing units, designing them, photographing them, you know, subleasing them basically on Airbnb.

00:11:19.600 --> 00:11:25.120
And this was before a lot of the cities were having big crackdowns and there was just not enough supply.

00:11:25.120 --> 00:11:27.279
So it was your classic arbitrage, right?

00:11:27.279 --> 00:11:28.639
I mean, not enough supply.

00:11:28.639 --> 00:11:31.519
People wanted short-term rentals, they wanted multiple bedrooms.

00:11:31.519 --> 00:11:35.120
And so I quit my job because of how that was growing.

00:11:35.120 --> 00:11:40.960
And then when I saw other people wanted me to manage properties for them, we really spun up a management company when I quit my job.

00:11:40.960 --> 00:11:45.600
And so we grew from eight units under management to 200 in about 18 months.

00:11:45.600 --> 00:11:49.840
COVID hit early 20, early 2020.

00:11:49.840 --> 00:12:00.639
So in March, I was actually at an off-site with the team that we had built up in the Philippines that was our guest communications and really our entire VA army for the short-term rental business.

00:12:00.639 --> 00:12:07.759
And it was when I was over there, you know, trying to have this like, you know, morale boosting retreat that COVID really hit in earnest.

00:12:07.759 --> 00:12:10.000
All of our bookings got canceled overnight.

00:12:10.000 --> 00:12:21.039
And, you know, it was terrifying at the time, but I think that it really pushed me to think outside the box and to pursue something that had kind of been gnawing at me for a while.

00:12:21.039 --> 00:12:26.240
This idea of Onera, I had sort of been thinking about for well over a year.

00:12:26.240 --> 00:12:29.519
I had friends that were doing unique stays in Joshua Tree.

00:12:29.519 --> 00:12:34.960
I did this, you know, road trip for my honeymoon across the southwestern US in an RV.

00:12:34.960 --> 00:12:45.360
So I like I was re-falling in love with the great outdoors and I saw, you know, the trend of these unique experiential outdoor stays doing, you know, better and better.

00:12:45.360 --> 00:12:48.320
Um then when COVID hit, it was just like gasoline on the fire.

00:12:48.320 --> 00:12:54.240
And so, yeah, started looking for land within a couple weeks of COVID really hitting, I think.

00:12:54.240 --> 00:12:58.159
And we, we, you know, I took some developer lumps in that year.

00:12:58.159 --> 00:13:04.159
And then by the end of that year, we had found our property after, you know, kind of screwing it up on two deals prior.

00:13:04.159 --> 00:13:17.200
On our third one, we we found the property that became O'Neill Fredericksburg, this amazing, you know, seven-acre piece of property just a mile from Main Street, but really felt like it was, it was tucked into the this enchanted forest with a creek.

00:13:17.200 --> 00:13:27.200
And it really felt off the beaten path and remote, but it was super close and convenient to Main Street, which was really important to the concept because I didn't want to get into FB.

00:13:27.200 --> 00:13:29.679
I didn't want to get into like full service hotel land.

00:13:29.679 --> 00:13:40.480
So being that close to Main Street, restaurants, bars, shops was was super important to have, you know, as a complement to this limited service, you know, limited amenity product that O'Nera is.

00:13:40.879 --> 00:13:51.600
Do you think that that opportunity or that climate still exists to have, you know, like one influencer come out to your property and it, you know, is kind of like an overnight excess.

00:13:51.600 --> 00:13:55.200
Like, does that still exist in the world of social media and influencers these days?

00:13:55.600 --> 00:13:58.960
Massively successful influencer social media posts definitely still exists.

00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:02.639
I do think that there is a lot more, a lot more noise.

00:14:02.639 --> 00:14:10.720
There's a lot more fluff, there's a lot, you know, there's a lot more sort of landmines that that you're potentially stepping on because influencers are charging more.

00:14:10.720 --> 00:14:13.759
A lot of them are not worth what they're charging, I don't think today.

00:14:13.759 --> 00:14:17.279
And then there are the few that are worth what they're charging and more.

00:14:17.279 --> 00:14:17.679
Right.

00:14:17.679 --> 00:14:21.519
So the way I look at influencer marketing today is it's kind of on a bell curve.

00:14:21.519 --> 00:14:27.919
There's like the really good influencer marketers who are the best creators in in market, right?

00:14:27.919 --> 00:14:32.720
So Texas Explorer, the one that came out to us, she's still the best, you know, in in our market.

00:14:32.720 --> 00:14:36.720
There's a couple others in our area, I would say like three to four that are the best.

00:14:36.720 --> 00:14:40.399
And they charge, you know, three, four, five grand a pop, and they're totally worth it, right?

00:14:40.399 --> 00:14:43.600
I'll pay it all day, no problem, as long as there's not audience fatigue.

00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:47.840
So you only want to have them out every, you know, once a year, once every two years, something like that.

00:14:47.840 --> 00:14:53.440
And then on the other side, you have all of these, you know, what might be called micro influencers, right?

00:14:53.440 --> 00:14:58.559
Much smaller followings, they're on the come up still, you know, you're just giving them a free stay.

00:14:58.559 --> 00:15:15.519
And if I'm very unlikely to be displacing revenue, so you know, it's a weeknight or a day that I'm very unlikely to be fully occupied, I'm happy to have a micro influencer come, you know, share our property with their audience and and you know, hopefully we get some conversions, we help grow our following, et cetera.

00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:16.639
It's it's very low investment.

00:15:16.960 --> 00:15:19.759
Connor, do you want to talk about glamping permits for a second?

00:15:20.240 --> 00:15:22.000
Yeah, it's it's hugely important.

00:15:22.000 --> 00:15:29.440
The two biggest roadblocks to getting you know glamping projects built is the funding and the entitlement and the permitting.

00:15:29.440 --> 00:15:31.440
So it's it's a really big deal.

00:15:31.840 --> 00:15:45.279
Yeah, and it can be a very challenging and you know, sometimes quite intimidating process, not just putting all the materials together, but presenting it to the county, often going through the public hearing process, which can be really scary and sometimes quite nasty.

00:15:45.279 --> 00:15:49.840
And that's why it does help to have people who are used to doing this on your side.

00:15:49.840 --> 00:15:55.440
And that's why we're delighted to announce that uh today's sponsors are Clockwork Architecture and Design.

00:15:55.440 --> 00:15:57.919
They're an architecture firm based in Kansas City.

00:15:57.919 --> 00:16:04.720
They have a specialist outdoor hospitality division that have done tons of work in the glamping and RV resort space.

00:16:04.720 --> 00:16:10.559
They're experts at designing and permitting glamping resorts or whatever kind of outdoor hospitality project it is.

00:16:10.559 --> 00:16:22.720
They'll come to your property, walk the land with you, work at work through a concept with you, design the whole layout of the site, and then gather all the materials for the county, deal with the county, deal with the public hearings if you'd like them to.

00:16:22.720 --> 00:16:26.480
And they're just you know all-round fantastic partners to have on your side.

00:16:26.480 --> 00:16:30.879
And Connor, I know you and Sage have had some pretty good experiences with clockwork as well.

00:16:31.440 --> 00:16:37.120
Yeah, we've we've been working with clockwork literally the entire time that I've been at the company, so for four years.

00:16:37.120 --> 00:16:40.240
And so we've done dozens and dozens of projects with them.

00:16:40.240 --> 00:16:45.759
And love the chance to get to work with them because you know they are the best and most experienced in the industry.

00:16:45.759 --> 00:16:50.639
They they really know outdoor hospitality and they've designed some world-class sites.

00:16:50.639 --> 00:16:53.039
It's just, yeah, they're they're very talented.

00:16:53.039 --> 00:16:55.120
You'd be in good hands to work with them.

00:16:55.600 --> 00:17:00.000
Yeah, and I can't vouch highly enough for Christian Arnold at Clockwork, the owner.

00:17:00.000 --> 00:17:06.240
He's a you know fantastic guy who cares about what he does, looks after his clients, very reliable communication-wise as well.

00:17:06.240 --> 00:17:08.880
And yeah, we're we're super excited to partner with them on this.

00:17:08.880 --> 00:17:18.160
So if you are looking for site designs, you know, entitlement help, whatever it may be in that field, then do contact Clockwork Architecture and Design.

00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:23.920
And the way you can do that is by emailing Christian at clockwork-ad.com.

00:17:23.920 --> 00:17:25.839
All the details will be in the description as well.

00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:27.200
So go check that out if you want.

00:17:27.200 --> 00:17:28.960
So, yeah, thank you, Clockwork.

00:17:28.960 --> 00:17:30.480
We couldn't recommend them highly enough.

00:17:30.480 --> 00:17:31.119
Go check them out.

00:17:31.519 --> 00:17:34.319
At the beginning of your journey, you were on all the OTAs.

00:17:34.319 --> 00:17:38.319
And then so obviously going direct marketing is better.

00:17:38.319 --> 00:17:46.559
I wonder if that's harder now, just with all of the noise in social media, you know, to be found.

00:17:46.559 --> 00:17:50.319
It's not as much of a barren landscape, it feels like, on social media.

00:17:50.319 --> 00:17:53.039
There's just there's a ton of commercial advertising, right?

00:17:53.039 --> 00:17:54.880
So it doesn't cut through quite quite the same way.

00:17:54.880 --> 00:17:57.759
But so I imagine a lot of people are starting on OTAs.

00:17:57.759 --> 00:18:03.359
What is your strategy with OTAs, you know, at least at the beginning, while you're like building a brand and a following?

00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:04.960
Or you just don't use them at all?

00:18:05.279 --> 00:18:07.920
So again, I think it's actually kind of binary.

00:18:07.920 --> 00:18:12.240
So with my last company, we were commodity short-term rentals in cities.

00:18:12.240 --> 00:18:18.160
So, in my view, sort of more commodity short-term rental company, you shouldn't invest anything in your brand.

00:18:18.160 --> 00:18:19.119
And we didn't, right?

00:18:19.119 --> 00:18:20.880
Just go all in on the OTAs.

00:18:20.880 --> 00:18:32.720
You know, your brand is your profile, the review score that you have, you know, constantly trying to optimize those listings, stay ahead of the curve, add amenities, add better photos and designs that make your listings pop.

00:18:32.720 --> 00:18:37.759
And I know people that do well in that space, but don't waste a dollar on brand, right?

00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:40.480
Because I don't think personally, I don't think consumers care.

00:18:40.480 --> 00:18:56.799
But if you do have some a product that's very unique, it has potential on social media, and you do want to invest in a brand, then yes, I think that it is still very possible and optimal to go all in on content marketing, video, social media.

00:18:56.799 --> 00:18:59.519
And it is harder today, you're not wrong.

00:18:59.519 --> 00:19:10.559
But if you have a great product and you know you get smart on content and video, or you work with a company or contractors that are really good at it, then I think you can definitely still cut through.

00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:13.359
And with social media, like it's constantly evolving.

00:19:13.359 --> 00:19:15.279
So you have to be staying ahead of the curve.

00:19:15.279 --> 00:19:18.799
Like what worked a year or two ago may not be working the same way today.

00:19:18.799 --> 00:19:20.880
I mean, we've seen that with giveaways, right?

00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:25.200
Influencer giveaways was like, you know, almost a sure thing a couple of years ago.

00:19:25.200 --> 00:19:29.359
And now it's very dependent not only on the influencer and your account.

00:19:29.359 --> 00:19:36.480
By the way, if your account has trash engagement and you do a collab with an influencer, a lot of times that post will get throttled.

00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:45.440
So even if it might have done well otherwise, because your account has poor engagement, you know, it won't do as well as if the creator just maybe posted it on their own if they have good engagement on their page.

00:19:45.440 --> 00:19:46.880
So there's all these nuances.

00:19:46.880 --> 00:19:53.599
It's definitely harder, but we have found it to be the most sticky, highest paying guests.

00:19:53.599 --> 00:19:56.160
We control the entire customer journey.

00:19:56.160 --> 00:19:59.039
So, you know, I still think there's huge value in that.

00:19:59.039 --> 00:19:59.759
Today for us.

00:19:59.759 --> 00:20:14.480
Us the OTAs are really a way to fill in lower demand days, you know, to try to, you know, just reach a different audience that, you know, allows us to get to the occupancy thresholds and the rev bar that we're trying to get to with our properties.

00:20:14.480 --> 00:20:18.079
I know some properties that almost exclusively do direct bookings.

00:20:18.079 --> 00:20:19.680
I think that's also a mistake, right?

00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:21.440
Or they do 100% direct bookings.

00:20:21.440 --> 00:20:29.119
Like there's no downside, in my view, to having broader distribution because you're reaching a guest that you wouldn't otherwise reach, in my opinion.

00:20:29.119 --> 00:20:31.359
So there's incremental occupancy there.

00:20:31.359 --> 00:20:37.759
So our golden rule, typically what we look for is about 80 to 85% direct and 15 to 20% OTA.

00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:38.480
Awesome.

00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:47.920
What what advice would you have for someone who's starting their brand from like a social media or a content creation perspective?

00:20:47.920 --> 00:20:54.799
Is there any just like basic fundamentals, like one, two, three steps for them to start to start to get their brand going or tell their story?

00:20:54.799 --> 00:21:00.079
And do you do you think it's more about the business and and the product?

00:21:00.079 --> 00:21:07.119
Or do you think it's more about the person behind the business and their story or any any opinions there?

00:21:07.119 --> 00:21:09.279
Either one can work, right?

00:21:09.599 --> 00:21:19.519
I think that it's harder to do it's harder to do like build in public and grow this big audience just based on the product before it's built.

00:21:19.519 --> 00:21:20.880
I think that is challenging.

00:21:20.880 --> 00:21:22.079
There are ways to do it.

00:21:22.079 --> 00:21:30.480
I mean, you know, I know you're aware of the strategy of like advanced crowdfunding or advanced reservation crowdfunding through like Indiegogo, running ads to build a list.

00:21:30.480 --> 00:21:34.640
Like I think that's one way that you can do it based on product, but you are running ads, right?

00:21:34.640 --> 00:21:35.680
It's not organic social.

00:21:35.680 --> 00:21:44.480
With organic social in the development phase, the best and most proven way to do that, and again, it's not easy, is the build-in public model.

00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:48.640
And I think the the probably the best example right now is Rajan Cheetah.

00:21:48.640 --> 00:21:53.680
I don't know if you've seen his stuff, but he's got almost half a million followers.

00:21:53.680 --> 00:22:03.039
I think he, I think he might have only started in 2025 this project that he's doing that's like a unique stay, kind of like live oak at Live Oak Lake-esque type cabins.

00:22:03.039 --> 00:22:04.960
Is this the young the young guy?

00:22:04.960 --> 00:22:05.359
Yeah.

00:22:05.359 --> 00:22:06.559
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:22:06.559 --> 00:22:09.519
And like he's he understands social media, right?

00:22:09.519 --> 00:22:12.400
Like he's he's got visual hooks in every video.

00:22:12.400 --> 00:22:18.559
He's building in public, he's you know asking the audience what what they would do, you know, X or Y.

00:22:18.559 --> 00:22:22.640
Should we do a you know a wood burning or an electric hot tub, right?

00:22:22.640 --> 00:22:29.119
Like he's he's like engaging the audience in these questions and literally making decisions, at least partially based on you know audience feedback.

00:22:29.119 --> 00:22:32.400
So he's really engaging, he's got a very engaged community, right?

00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:34.640
And and it's it's also it's very relatable, right?

00:22:34.640 --> 00:22:36.079
I think he's doing one or two units.

00:22:36.079 --> 00:22:41.200
It's not a huge hotel, which is sometimes my challenge and has been my challenge with the build-in public.

00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:48.799
It's like, you know, if I'm doing a 15, 20 million dollar resort, there's a much smaller audience segment that that is relevant to, right?

00:22:48.799 --> 00:22:58.960
Whereas like Isaac, you know, Rajan, like they're doing smaller, more achievable projects that have a bigger, you know, mass audience potential.

00:22:58.960 --> 00:23:02.400
So I build in public, Devin Lurup, right, is another great example.

00:23:02.400 --> 00:23:03.680
He did Pacific Bin.

00:23:03.680 --> 00:23:12.720
It's five shipping containers oriented in this, you know, crazy, I think he has multiple now, uh, short-term rental in in Washington, in the beautiful forest.

00:23:12.720 --> 00:23:17.039
So those, those would be the two shining examples, but it's a big commitment, right?

00:23:17.039 --> 00:23:24.400
I mean, you need to be posting daily, documenting the journey, understand visual hooks, audio, and and on-screen hooks as well.

00:23:24.400 --> 00:23:28.720
And so I think that has the longest term value.

00:23:28.720 --> 00:23:31.759
You're building a brand and an audience well before you open.

00:23:31.759 --> 00:23:39.279
It can lead to future media opportunities, it can lead to investment, it can lead to you know selling out your property easily with a single post.

00:23:39.279 --> 00:23:41.119
So huge value in that.

00:23:41.119 --> 00:23:43.920
And there's huge value in personal brand in general.

00:23:43.920 --> 00:23:51.839
I mean, I didn't start sort of from the personal brand lens and posting a lot, you know, on LinkedIn, Twitter, now Instagram.

00:23:51.839 --> 00:23:53.039
Um, I did not start that way.

00:23:53.039 --> 00:24:00.559
I was kind of heads down building Onera, but really delving into that in the last two, three years, it's been incredible the results that have come from it.

00:24:00.559 --> 00:24:10.160
Like Baya, our property in Florida, is due to a podcast that I landed on with my partner Steve Turk that only happened because he saw me posting on LinkedIn and Twitter.

00:24:10.160 --> 00:24:16.000
And, you know, almost all of our investors in Baya came from people that follow me on social media.

00:24:16.000 --> 00:24:22.400
So it's it it there's tremendous value with arguably, I don't have that big of a following, right?

00:24:22.400 --> 00:24:26.400
But it's it's niche, it's high authority, um, it's a very engaged community.

00:24:26.400 --> 00:24:30.240
And I only have, you know, 15,000, 20,000 followers on each platform.

00:24:30.559 --> 00:24:31.359
Yeah, yeah.

00:24:31.359 --> 00:24:32.240
Very cool.

00:24:32.240 --> 00:24:36.480
And all right, so what was next for uh on the Onera journey?

00:24:36.480 --> 00:24:38.799
I know we kind of got a little bit off topic.

00:24:39.119 --> 00:24:40.160
Sidracked there, yeah, yeah.

00:24:40.160 --> 00:24:42.000
There's a lot of rabbit holes that we can go down.

00:24:42.000 --> 00:24:54.319
So Onera, Open Fredericksburg did immediately, you know, really well out the gate, transitioned to doing more social media content marketing in 22, really with influencers, and then 2023 our own content.

00:24:54.319 --> 00:24:56.319
And that's when we stood up the OASI team.

00:24:56.319 --> 00:25:04.559
We tried to outsource it to an agency that fell on its face because traditional hotel marketing agencies, in my view, don't understand content usually.

00:25:04.559 --> 00:25:10.960
They're not content first, they're not content creators, they are marketers purely and oftentimes PR people.

00:25:10.960 --> 00:25:14.640
So watch out for that because content is the whole gig.

00:25:14.640 --> 00:25:15.680
That is the gold.

00:25:15.680 --> 00:25:20.160
So we built a team for our own properties, content first, really focused on that.

00:25:20.160 --> 00:25:26.400
Videographers, editors, content creators, copywriters, all the people that we needed to create incredible organic content.

00:25:26.400 --> 00:25:32.720
And that's what led us to this 80 to 85% direct booking ratio, which I think is kind of the gold standard.

00:25:32.720 --> 00:25:34.319
So that's what led to Owasi.

00:25:34.319 --> 00:25:40.640
And then we started doing it for third-party clients that saw our success and were asking, you know, asking us to do it for them as well.

00:25:40.640 --> 00:25:42.880
So that's kind of what happened with O'Neira.

00:25:42.880 --> 00:25:49.279
And we had a public REIT that you mentioned, some at Hotel Properties that saw our early success.

00:25:49.279 --> 00:25:51.599
I think we actually connected with them around the time that we opened.

00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:52.799
They really liked what we were doing.

00:25:52.799 --> 00:25:54.319
They needed to see a little bit more.

00:25:54.319 --> 00:25:56.559
We spent like a year negotiating.

00:25:56.559 --> 00:26:00.640
And by the end of 2023, we sold to them a majority stake.

00:26:00.640 --> 00:26:11.119
So 90% interest at a $7 million valuation, which, you know, was a really big win for our investors and, you know, track record on that project.

00:26:11.119 --> 00:26:17.680
And another reason that they bought, I think, was that there was expansion potential to Fredericksburg, which we've now realized.

00:26:17.680 --> 00:26:28.000
So we expanded O'Neill Fredericksburg from 12 keys to 35, which just opened in June of June, July of this year.

00:26:28.000 --> 00:26:33.440
And we have some of the most audacious, crazy designs yet at that at that location.

00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:37.920
And they also liked that we had a second location in the works at that time.

00:26:37.920 --> 00:26:43.359
In 2023, we were kind of in the planning and pre-development stages at O'Neill-Wimberly, the property that you went to.

00:26:43.359 --> 00:26:49.839
So that's about an hour and 15 minutes from Fredericksburg, still Texas Hill Country, but a very different vibe and type of property.

00:26:49.839 --> 00:26:52.720
It's got these incredible long hill country views.

00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:57.200
It's it's very close to this quaint town of Wimberley, whereas Fredericksburg is more like tucked in the woods.

00:26:57.200 --> 00:27:00.799
So yeah, that Wimberly one we opened end of 24.

00:27:01.119 --> 00:27:01.599
Amazing.

00:27:01.599 --> 00:27:01.920
Yes.

00:27:01.920 --> 00:27:04.160
The I've seen Wimberly, it's beautiful.

00:27:04.160 --> 00:27:11.599
Really well done in terms of building into the landscape, creating views and separation.

00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:15.759
Well imagine like a really, really well done resort pool.

00:27:15.759 --> 00:27:22.160
And you know, very unique units with lots of wonderful views, floor to ceiling glass.

00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:23.759
All of your units have hot tubs.

00:27:23.759 --> 00:27:24.640
So I was really impressed.

00:27:24.640 --> 00:27:28.319
I haven't had a chance to see Fredericksburg yet, so I need to get out there.

00:27:28.319 --> 00:27:31.200
But I forgot that you guys had just done that massive expansion.

00:27:31.200 --> 00:27:38.400
So how how are how are Wimblerly and Fredericksburg, you know, doing today in the last maybe in 2025?

00:27:38.640 --> 00:27:42.079
Yeah, so we're we're getting close to stabilization in Wimberley.

00:27:42.079 --> 00:27:45.519
You know, I thought that we actually hit, we're gonna hit stabilization this summer.

00:27:45.519 --> 00:27:51.839
And then those really nasty floods where you know some really horrific things happened in the hill country, really kicked us in the teeth.

00:27:51.839 --> 00:27:58.319
Not that we were super impacted by the flugs, but just from like a market standpoint, things softened a bit July, August, September.

00:27:58.319 --> 00:28:01.680
But we're seeing big pickup, October, November are looking very strong.

00:28:01.680 --> 00:28:06.000
So my, you know, it feels like we're gonna stabilize in 26.

00:28:06.000 --> 00:28:13.440
But yeah, Wimberley, we're consistently seeing ADRs month over month, anywhere from like low to mid fours to low fives.

00:28:13.440 --> 00:28:19.759
So, you know, 400s to 500s with occupancies anywhere from 70 to you know 85%.

00:28:19.759 --> 00:28:24.319
So still performing pretty well, I would say already.

00:28:24.319 --> 00:28:35.119
And looking at, you know, looking the goal is to get that to, you know, 500s, you know, close to 500 consistently on the ADR side at around a 75 to you know 80% occupancy.

00:28:35.440 --> 00:28:37.359
Man, very impressive.

00:28:37.359 --> 00:28:38.319
Very impressive.

00:28:38.319 --> 00:28:42.319
And maybe let's take it to uh let's take a minute to chat about Owasi.

00:28:42.319 --> 00:28:47.440
Can you tell us about Owasi, when you started it, what what you do, the services that you provide?

00:28:47.759 --> 00:28:48.400
Yeah, happy to.

00:28:48.400 --> 00:28:54.400
So Owasi really grow out grew out of a massive need of ONERA and some of our other properties as well.

00:28:54.400 --> 00:28:58.720
We had a hotel in Palm Springs that I was involved in the renovation of and raised the money around.

00:28:58.720 --> 00:28:59.680
It was part of my fund.

00:28:59.680 --> 00:29:11.119
So that property, Spirit of Sophia and ONERA, really wanted to invest heavily in social media and create amazing organic content, but we could not find an agency that would do it well.

00:29:11.119 --> 00:29:14.400
So we ended up building up the team ourselves and it started small.

00:29:14.400 --> 00:29:20.640
You know, videographer and and my partner in that business, who I didn't really get to talk about a ton yet, Jesse, who's been a longtime friend.

00:29:20.640 --> 00:29:22.079
I actually used to work for him.

00:29:22.079 --> 00:29:30.160
He's largely the like content marketing genius that has stood up AWASI from a you know, building out that social media marketing team.

00:29:30.160 --> 00:29:37.519
So he was really the brains and pattern recognition and sort of geeking out on content that led us to the success that we had early on.

00:29:37.519 --> 00:29:39.440
And he's helped to kind of grow the team.

00:29:39.440 --> 00:29:44.880
And now we have an amazing team of 25 people at AWASI, over half of which are on the marketing side.

00:29:44.880 --> 00:29:51.440
So we're getting ideas and new formats and and all of that from you know across the team.

00:29:51.440 --> 00:30:00.240
But uh early on, it was largely Jesse's brain and the videographer that we hired first, this guy, Josh, who is our head of content and videography now.

00:30:00.240 --> 00:30:02.559
And so that's kind of the humble beginnings of where we started.

00:30:02.559 --> 00:30:04.079
Josh was editing all the videos.

00:30:04.079 --> 00:30:18.240
And today we're yeah, 25 strong experts across, you know, every area, videographers, editors, copywriters, creative associates, like even like true content creators that can do the full stack to test new concepts or viral hackers, right?

00:30:18.240 --> 00:30:23.279
They're looking at trends, seeing what's working, seeing how we can replicate it and incorporate it into what we do.

00:30:23.279 --> 00:30:27.759
Email marketers, we have a great partner when it comes to SEO and Google ads.

00:30:27.759 --> 00:30:30.480
And then we're really strong at meta-ads internally.

00:30:30.480 --> 00:30:33.039
So we have someone who runs all of our meta-ads.

00:30:33.039 --> 00:30:35.519
And that's on the marketing side of things.

00:30:35.519 --> 00:30:44.559
So today we can effectively operate as your fully outsourced chief marketing officer with specialists in each of these areas.

00:30:44.559 --> 00:30:51.839
And it all comes down, you know, the linchpin of the whole strategy and how we add value is with the content.

00:30:51.839 --> 00:30:53.599
So it starts with amazing content.

00:30:53.599 --> 00:30:57.839
We get high organic engagement, we get great awareness from organic social.

00:30:57.839 --> 00:31:00.559
We take the winners of our posts.

00:31:00.559 --> 00:31:06.480
So the best video that we have from an organic engagement standpoint, and we convert that into meta ads.

00:31:06.480 --> 00:31:08.319
So those become high and Google ads.

00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:13.599
So those become very high performing ads because the creative is so good and it's been tested organically.

00:31:13.599 --> 00:31:18.079
A lot of hotels and unique cities out there are very much flying blind with their creative.

00:31:18.079 --> 00:31:19.200
They don't know what works.

00:31:19.200 --> 00:31:23.680
They're, you know, agencies typically will test like two creatives over the course of months.

00:31:23.680 --> 00:31:27.680
We're create, we're testing dozens, you know, over the same period, right?

00:31:27.680 --> 00:31:34.160
At any one time, we might have a dozen different pieces pieces of creative getting optimized within Meta and Google.

00:31:34.160 --> 00:31:36.480
So, yeah, that's kind of what we do on the marketing side.

00:31:36.480 --> 00:31:42.960
And then the other area of our business where I think we have the most edge and the most value to add is revenue management.

00:31:42.960 --> 00:31:46.160
So we can effectively act as your chief revenue officer.

00:31:46.160 --> 00:31:58.400
We are more manual and less you know, plug plug it into your favorite dynamic pricing tool and it will spit out what I often see as garbage in, garbage out results.

00:31:58.400 --> 00:32:03.680
So oftentimes, like price labs, which we use price labs by the way, but we use it to push pricing.

00:32:03.680 --> 00:32:16.079
But people that just use price labs and their dynamic pricing out of the box or beyond pricing or one of these other revenue management tools, very often it is pulling marketwide data, heavily weighting that.

00:32:16.079 --> 00:32:21.279
Your product may be very different from the products that it's pulling pricing for.

00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:27.920
Even if it's similar, those competitors might have a very suboptimal strategy that you are now anchoring to, right?

00:32:27.920 --> 00:32:45.680
So we found it much more effective and it to be well worth it to have true pricing analysts and data analysts checking, checking market availability and inventory movement, checking pacing on a daily basis, building out custom models that effectively rank order every day of the year into tiers.

00:32:45.680 --> 00:32:49.119
And then that can fluctuate, you know, based on what we're seeing in the market.

00:32:49.119 --> 00:32:56.160
But it is manual, but we have some of the best and brightest on our revenue management team, you know, pushing, pushing that edge.

00:32:56.160 --> 00:33:10.720
And I mean, we've seen when we combine the revenue management and the pricing, the revenue management and the marketing side of things together, when we combine it together, we've had some clients that have been up, you know, 60, 70% year over year in in terms of their revenue.

00:33:10.720 --> 00:33:13.039
So the the results can be pretty phenomenal.

00:33:13.359 --> 00:33:13.599
Wow.

00:33:13.599 --> 00:33:14.400
Amazing.

00:33:14.400 --> 00:33:23.680
And marketing and advertising has gotten so sophisticated with algorithms and all the different channels that it's it's really impossible for any one person to do.

00:33:23.680 --> 00:33:25.200
And it takes a whole team.

00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:29.359
And even in your big team, I know you you mentioned you have some partners that you go to, right?

00:33:29.359 --> 00:33:33.519
Which is just what you have to do because everyone has to specialize at what they're best at.

00:33:33.519 --> 00:33:41.359
What's your typical client and what does, you know, what kind of packages are you offering for folks?

00:33:41.680 --> 00:33:42.880
Yeah, it's a good question.

00:33:42.880 --> 00:33:46.160
And we're actually getting more standardized with our offering.

00:33:46.160 --> 00:33:48.960
And I think we have a really strong offer at this point.

00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:54.960
We are targeting bigger clients, you know, unfortunately for some of the smaller glamping operators out there.

00:33:54.960 --> 00:33:57.759
I have a lot of them come to me asking for quotes.

00:33:57.759 --> 00:34:05.519
And it's it's very often hard for us to justify taking on a client that's, you know, sub a million a year or even sub two million a year.

00:34:05.519 --> 00:34:09.920
So our target is really two to four million annual revenue plus.

00:34:09.920 --> 00:34:20.800
And we are, you know, our ideal client is signing up with us for both marketing, so at least social media and content, if not full stack marketing, and revenue management.

00:34:20.800 --> 00:34:22.719
So, and we try to make it pretty attractive.

00:34:22.719 --> 00:34:25.039
We believe in our product to such an extent.

00:34:25.039 --> 00:34:28.079
Uh, on the revenue management side, we do a lot of money-back guarantees.

00:34:28.079 --> 00:34:30.400
Like if you know, work with us, 90-day lock-in.

00:34:30.400 --> 00:34:32.320
If you don't see a lift, don't pay us.

00:34:32.320 --> 00:34:34.320
I mean, that's how much we believe in what we do.

00:34:34.320 --> 00:34:45.280
And then on the marketing side, we've really shifted to we're pretty much operating at cost with a big incentive portion of it for us to make our money.

00:34:45.280 --> 00:34:47.039
So there's a few different tiers.

00:34:47.039 --> 00:34:50.239
Uh, the base tier starts around seven grand a month.

00:34:50.239 --> 00:34:54.000
And then, so it's seven grand a month for all of your content.

00:34:54.000 --> 00:35:02.239
So it includes all your videography, editing, posting, comments, DMs, multiple platforms, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, includes your email marketing.

00:35:02.239 --> 00:35:02.719
Okay.

00:35:02.719 --> 00:35:06.079
If you want to run ads, that'll just be 20% of ad spend.

00:35:06.079 --> 00:35:10.079
Any other fixed cost is based into that seven grand a month.

00:35:10.079 --> 00:35:14.000
And then we have a performance incentive, which is a dollar per link tap.

00:35:14.000 --> 00:35:22.159
And link tap is effectively who goes into your Instagram profile and clicks on the website link on your profile.

00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:24.000
So it's very targeted traffic.

00:35:24.000 --> 00:35:27.920
True revenue attribution is very challenging with organic social.

00:35:27.920 --> 00:35:31.840
And I could do a whole podcast or YouTube video on why that is.

00:35:31.840 --> 00:35:37.519
So we really rely on link taps as the most down funneled targeted traffic metric that we can get.

00:35:37.519 --> 00:35:40.480
So we do seven grand a month plus a dollar a link tap.

00:35:40.480 --> 00:35:45.280
And typically we're targeting anywhere from five to 10,000 link taps per month.

00:35:45.280 --> 00:35:50.000
So our fees can get you know over 10K pretty quick, but we're driving a ton of value.

00:35:50.000 --> 00:36:07.039
If you look at your Instagram page and you want to find out how many link taps you're generating today, you go into the professional dashboard, you go into the, I think it's like audience or views or something like that, and then you scroll to the bottom and it shows the number of link taps that you had in a 30 or 90 day period.

00:36:07.039 --> 00:36:17.039
Typically, with people before we take them on, they're seeing anywhere from you know 50 to a couple hundred link taps a month, and we're bringing them to five to 10,000.

00:36:17.039 --> 00:36:19.440
So it's like a 10, 20x bump.

00:36:19.440 --> 00:36:20.480
Yeah, amazing.

00:36:20.639 --> 00:36:26.480
And then so it's what you said, 7,000, and that's the that's kind of the management fee that goes to Awasi.

00:36:26.480 --> 00:36:31.119
And then how much is being spent on the actual paid ad on top of that?

00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:33.119
It totally depends on the property.

00:36:33.119 --> 00:36:42.320
So if if you're if you're doing one to two mil a year in revenue, even like a little over two, you can do a lot with organic, right?

00:36:42.320 --> 00:36:45.760
With really good organic social, you don't necessarily have to be spending a bunch on ads.

00:36:45.760 --> 00:36:52.880
If you're getting into like the $5 million a year target in revenue, you're probably doing a really good job with us with organic social.

00:36:52.880 --> 00:36:59.760
And you're probably also spending, you know, 10, 15, sometimes 20 grand a month on across all ads, right?

00:36:59.760 --> 00:37:05.280
Google, Google search, branded, unbranded, PMAX, you know, Meta on Facebook and Instagram.

00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:07.440
So it's very client dependent.

00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:10.960
And we're only going to spend more if the ROAS is there, right?

00:37:10.960 --> 00:37:13.199
If if the return on the ad spend is there and makes sense.

00:37:13.199 --> 00:37:13.519
Yeah.

00:37:13.599 --> 00:37:19.360
And I'm I'm you we're usually recommending people spend like an absolute minimum of 5% on marketing and advertising.

00:37:19.360 --> 00:37:22.079
That's probably low compared to what you guys do and what you guys say.

00:37:22.239 --> 00:37:23.760
No, I think five, yeah, it is the low end.

00:37:23.760 --> 00:37:26.079
I would say five to 10% is what we recommend.

00:37:26.079 --> 00:37:30.000
And especially if if you're trying to drive most of your bookings direct.

00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:31.599
So one thing you can think about, right?

00:37:31.599 --> 00:37:41.519
If you're doing 80 to 85% direct and way less with OTAs, take what you would be spending on commissions and be willing to at least spend some of that on your marketing, right?

00:37:41.519 --> 00:37:45.519
Because a lot of people don't include OTA commissions in their marketing and sales bucket.

00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:46.559
But that's basically what it is.

00:37:46.880 --> 00:37:48.639
That's an amazing way to look at it.

00:37:48.639 --> 00:37:54.960
It if you if if if you're getting 80% of your income from OTAs and they're taking what, I don't know, 10% or something like that.

00:37:54.960 --> 00:37:55.920
At least 15.

00:37:56.000 --> 00:38:06.079
I mean, Airbnb is 15 right now, booking.com, maybe some of the glamping ones are less, but you know, the main short-term rental and and hotel ones, booking.com, Expedia, Airbnb, it's all 15 to 25%.

00:38:06.639 --> 00:38:06.880
Yeah.

00:38:06.880 --> 00:38:10.320
So if most of your bookings are coming through OTAs, you're losing.

00:38:10.320 --> 00:38:14.559
Let's just say you do a million dollars a year, you know, that's that's $200,000.

00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:17.199
So that the OTAs are taking.

00:38:17.199 --> 00:38:32.239
So, you know, what Ben is saying is if you're getting people to book direct, mostly through socials and organic content, then if you spend $200,000 and now all of a sudden it flips and you have 80% direct bookings because you built out assets that you own and brand strength.

00:38:32.239 --> 00:38:33.280
It's more of an investment.

00:38:33.280 --> 00:38:39.039
You know, when you when you pay an OTA fee, that that gets you very minimal quality.

00:38:39.039 --> 00:38:42.559
Maybe you get reviews that are built up on those channels over time, but that's it.

00:38:42.559 --> 00:38:46.159
But when you're spending that money on marketing and advertising, that's an investment.

00:38:46.159 --> 00:38:52.000
Those are brand assets that you own on your website or on your socials forever.

00:38:52.000 --> 00:38:53.920
So it's it's it's a good way to go.

00:38:53.920 --> 00:38:54.960
And that's yeah.

00:38:54.960 --> 00:38:59.039
And then also, what's the cost of not of empty bed, of empty rooms?

00:38:59.039 --> 00:39:19.360
You know, so just calculate what's the cost on your property on a monthly basis, you know, if you're able to bring your occupancy from, you know, 60 to 65%, how much more revenue, how much more profit hits the bottom line, and then think about hey, should I be, do I think that pulling these levers in marketing and advertising might bring me from 60 to 65% occupancy?

00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:20.960
And how much extra money is that?

00:39:20.960 --> 00:39:32.320
And this is especially important in your first two years when you are building credibility, when you're building SEO, when you're getting reviews to kind of surface in the market.

00:39:32.719 --> 00:39:45.280
Yeah, and I would just say to echo that point, if if you can bump incremental occupancy, oftentimes going from 60 to 65, 65 to 70, that ends up being super high margin because you have fixed costs, right?

00:39:45.280 --> 00:39:48.559
So you have fixed costs that are getting spread out now across more bookings.

00:39:48.559 --> 00:39:50.800
So it's going to improve your overall profitability.

00:39:50.800 --> 00:39:56.000
And that last five, 10% of incremental occupancy is gonna be some of the higher highest margin.

00:39:56.239 --> 00:39:57.519
That's a hugely good point.

00:39:57.519 --> 00:39:57.920
Yeah.

00:39:57.920 --> 00:39:59.760
Every month you have your fixed cost, you pay your rent.

00:39:59.760 --> 00:40:04.079
You pay a lot of your utilities, your insurance, like those stay the same.

00:40:04.079 --> 00:40:06.000
So, and you have to pay that every single month.

00:40:06.000 --> 00:40:10.639
And if you're able to get that extra 5%, just like Ben said, that's a that's a really good point as well.

00:40:11.119 --> 00:40:11.840
Hello, listeners.

00:40:11.840 --> 00:40:14.960
This is Sherry Halala, founder of Sage Outdoor Advisory.

00:40:14.960 --> 00:40:18.480
If you're launching an outdoor hospitality project like Clamping, we can help.

00:40:18.480 --> 00:40:20.800
We offer feasibility studies and appraisals.

00:40:20.800 --> 00:40:29.039
What that means is we look at your specific market and proposed business offering and complete an in-depth analysis to make sure that your planned business will be profitable.

00:40:29.039 --> 00:40:36.800
Getting a second opinion on your proposal and forecasted financials is critical to understand before you spend years of your time and hundreds of thousands of dollars.

00:40:36.800 --> 00:40:41.760
This is particularly important if you are looking to raise money for your project from a bank or private investors.

00:40:41.760 --> 00:40:47.440
They are going to want to see this type of deep dive analysis from an independent third-party specialist in the industry.

00:40:47.440 --> 00:40:56.079
We at Sage have completed well over 250 feasibility studies and appraisals in outdoor hospitality in North America in the last four years.

00:40:56.079 --> 00:41:00.000
So we understand what it takes to bring a project from concept to reality.

00:41:00.000 --> 00:41:06.800
If this sounds like it could be helpful to you, you can go to our website, SageOutdoorAdvisory.com, and schedule a call with our team.

00:41:06.800 --> 00:41:10.480
While you're there, check out our proprietary glamping database map too.

00:41:10.480 --> 00:41:10.960
Thanks.

00:41:10.960 --> 00:41:12.000
Now back to the show.

00:41:12.320 --> 00:41:15.440
So I guess kind of maybe spinning things off on Awasi.

00:41:15.440 --> 00:41:19.679
Any other updates on I mean, on that.

00:41:19.679 --> 00:41:23.199
Well, maybe we could maybe we could pivot to uh to to Baya.

00:41:23.199 --> 00:41:23.840
I'd love to hear.

00:41:23.840 --> 00:41:25.119
Did I pronounce that correctly?

00:41:25.119 --> 00:41:25.840
You did, yeah.

00:41:25.840 --> 00:41:26.239
Baya.

00:41:26.239 --> 00:41:26.480
Okay.

00:41:26.880 --> 00:41:27.920
Hopefully enough for people.

00:41:27.920 --> 00:41:29.599
I haven't heard too many people mispronounce it.

00:41:29.599 --> 00:41:32.079
So hopefully it's easy enough to to to say.

00:41:32.079 --> 00:41:43.360
But yeah, so Baya is a new brand that is effectively the combination of outdoor experiential travel, agritourism or farm hospitality, whatever you want to call it, and wellness.

00:41:43.360 --> 00:41:48.559
Okay, so it's kind of like a mashup of those three things that, of course, relate and are interconnected, right?

00:41:48.559 --> 00:41:54.639
So that's kind of the where the idea of Baya came from and what our brand pillars really are.

00:41:54.639 --> 00:41:59.360
First location, we are creating this tropical landscape resort.

00:41:59.360 --> 00:42:04.159
So think like jungle vibes mixed with exotic fruit farm, which is where the property is.

00:42:04.159 --> 00:42:08.719
It's on a 25-acre exotic fruit farm, just 45 minutes from Miami proper.

00:42:08.719 --> 00:42:10.159
So very well located.

00:42:10.159 --> 00:42:16.480
Think like Costa Rica Bali vibes, but stateside, and 45 minutes from Miami airport.

00:42:16.480 --> 00:42:17.519
So very accessible.

00:42:17.519 --> 00:42:23.599
And it's in this like booming agritourism, fruit farming.

00:42:23.599 --> 00:42:26.559
You know, they have wineries, fruit farms, monkey jungle.

00:42:26.559 --> 00:42:29.840
It's close to the Everglades, it's on the way to the Florida Keys.

00:42:29.840 --> 00:42:38.880
And it allows us to grow whatever exotic fruit, whatever tropical plants that we want to create this kind of otherworldly jungle environment.

00:42:38.880 --> 00:42:41.119
So that's what we're building with Baya.

00:42:41.119 --> 00:42:43.599
And we're, yeah, we're we're moving along.

00:42:43.599 --> 00:42:44.960
We're into permitting phase.

00:42:44.960 --> 00:42:46.639
We met with Miami-Dade County.

00:42:46.639 --> 00:42:49.840
We got the initial green light to move forward.

00:42:49.840 --> 00:42:53.440
And yeah, we have a site plan that's that's you know done.

00:42:53.440 --> 00:42:57.280
We have a modular manufacturer we're working with with unit designs done.

00:42:57.280 --> 00:43:03.360
We've stood up pretty much all the equity capital that we need, and we're we're finalizing the debt side right now.

00:43:03.760 --> 00:43:04.159
Wow.

00:43:04.159 --> 00:43:05.119
Super exciting.

00:43:05.119 --> 00:43:14.239
Can you tell me a little bit more about maybe what you have in mind for like the guest experience or the amenities and how you're how you're hitting those, you know, those new ideas.

00:43:14.559 --> 00:43:15.119
Yeah, yeah.

00:43:15.119 --> 00:43:15.920
Happy to.

00:43:15.920 --> 00:43:25.679
So we're just certainly going to be doing farm tours, farm to table, both dinners, cooking classes, you know, culinary experiences, smoothie making, you know, you name it.

00:43:25.679 --> 00:43:31.440
We will have a farm to table farm to table cafe and juicery, which is my first foray into F and B.

00:43:31.440 --> 00:43:32.239
Um I have a great.

00:43:32.960 --> 00:43:33.519
That's true.

00:43:33.519 --> 00:43:35.519
That whoa, that is one thing.

00:43:35.519 --> 00:43:39.679
You've you've gone so you've pushed such high rates without having F and B.

00:43:39.679 --> 00:43:40.559
Wow, good for you.

00:43:40.559 --> 00:43:41.760
I'm glad you're taking the plunge.

00:43:42.079 --> 00:43:42.800
Taking the plunge.

00:43:42.800 --> 00:43:49.679
So, and the only one of the only reasons I am is that I have a I'm literally working with the F and B director at Nobu Hotel in Miami, right?

00:43:49.679 --> 00:43:58.320
Like the guy that that that sort of consults all of the luxury hotels in Miami on what to what to launch for their F and B program and how to optimize it.

00:43:58.320 --> 00:43:59.280
And it's funny, right?

00:43:59.280 --> 00:44:05.039
Like he's he's been a big proponent of not having a full service fine dining, you know, fine dining restaurant.

00:44:05.039 --> 00:44:09.199
But we are, so what we're gonna do is we're having this, you know, health forward cafe concept.

00:44:09.199 --> 00:44:14.719
I don't know if you know Miami well, but this concept of pure puravita, this restaurant out there, is like blowing up.

00:44:14.719 --> 00:44:19.199
It's it's health forward cafe, counter service, but like really cool vibe.

00:44:19.199 --> 00:44:33.679
The the the rates they're able to charge are pretty unbelievable for like a salmon bowl, tuna bowl, like this, this kind of, you know, either just requires food prep or maybe a turbo chef or making a smoothie, but isn't a full-fledged commercial kitchen.

00:44:33.679 --> 00:44:38.400
So we're trying to, you know, there'll be a lot of raw food and you know, raw options.

00:44:38.400 --> 00:44:41.920
So we're we're sort of dialing in that menu, but it'll be very much seasonal.

00:44:41.920 --> 00:44:46.880
So it'll change, if not on a daily basis, at least on a weekly basis, depending on what's in season.

00:44:46.880 --> 00:44:52.480
We'll use whatever's in season all throughout the menu, which I think will be a cool experience for folks.

00:44:52.480 --> 00:44:56.159
There'll be plenty of things that we're growing on site, right?

00:44:56.159 --> 00:45:00.079
That's incorporated into the menu, which I think will be a cool experience for folks as well.

00:45:00.079 --> 00:45:03.360
So yeah, I'm really excited to kind of delve into that world.

00:45:03.360 --> 00:45:08.320
So that's kind of the farm hospitality, you know, the FB side of things.

00:45:08.320 --> 00:45:17.199
On the wellness side of things, I mean, we're gonna have, you know, hydrotherapy, contrast therapy, so cold plunge, hot tub, sauna, maybe multiple types of sauna.

00:45:17.199 --> 00:45:18.960
So infrared, dry.

00:45:18.960 --> 00:45:22.639
We will have these private grottos.

00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:29.199
So right below the surface is this white coral limestone in this area of uh Redland, Florida.

00:45:29.199 --> 00:45:32.639
So we can create these like cenote-looking pools.

00:45:32.639 --> 00:45:35.039
So we'll have some private grottos.

00:45:35.039 --> 00:45:41.039
There'll be like a big lagoon slash pool that will that will also sort of have that aesthetic and look.

00:45:41.039 --> 00:45:47.119
All of the bungalows will be tucked into this sort of like fruit forest jungle vibe.

00:45:47.119 --> 00:45:48.639
So they'll be very private.

00:45:48.639 --> 00:45:53.840
We plan to have a stream sort of meandering through this part of the property.

00:45:53.840 --> 00:45:59.039
So we'll have really great acoustics from a water, you know, water acoustics and and the sounds of nature.

00:45:59.039 --> 00:46:07.519
And I think the final piece that I'll touch on now and I could, you know, keep going on forever, but the final piece is sleep wellness, which has become very important to me.

00:46:07.519 --> 00:46:14.239
And I think like the pillar of, I mean, it's just sort of like the foundation of all wellness is sleep wellness.

00:46:14.239 --> 00:46:19.599
Because if you don't get a good night's sleep, it's like, you know, it's hard to make anything else work.

00:46:19.599 --> 00:46:24.480
So we're potentially going to be investing in bright beds or eight sleep mattresses.

00:46:24.480 --> 00:46:25.440
We haven't decided yet.

00:46:25.440 --> 00:46:30.159
Bright beds are they each side of the bed operates independently.

00:46:30.159 --> 00:46:52.880
So you can have separate firmness, you can have separate angle, you can also there's micro movements that that can actually like the mattress itself is is creating these micro movements that actually mimic the womb, which is wild, that help you fall asleep and also help get you into a lighter sleep stage if you're trying to wake up to at a certain time, right?

00:46:52.880 --> 00:47:06.400
So if you want to wake up at 7 a.m., it will do these micro movements within the 30 minutes before you get up to get you into a lighter sleep stage so that you have a higher readiness score and you're, you know, you don't wake up feeling super groggy in the middle of a deep sleep.

00:47:06.400 --> 00:47:14.800
So, you know, a lot of things that we're working on to really push the envelope on the wellness side of things, but but there's a taste of of some of the some of them that we're doing.

00:47:15.119 --> 00:47:15.360
Wow.

00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:16.960
So biohacking.

00:47:16.960 --> 00:47:21.599
What so so the chef, Steve Steve, right?

00:47:22.079 --> 00:47:28.239
Steve Turk, not not a chef, but a F and B expert, luxury, luxury hospitality expert, yeah.

00:47:28.239 --> 00:47:29.840
So he's been more like the guy.

00:47:29.840 --> 00:47:31.199
F B manager, correct.

00:47:31.199 --> 00:47:32.800
Sorry, F B manager, yeah.

00:47:32.800 --> 00:47:33.920
Oversees the chefs.

00:47:34.239 --> 00:47:34.480
Yep.

00:47:34.480 --> 00:47:35.119
Yeah, exactly.

00:47:35.119 --> 00:47:38.880
So he's saying he doesn't necessarily want to do a fine dining dinner.

00:47:38.880 --> 00:47:41.280
He wants to do more of like grab and go.

00:47:42.000 --> 00:47:49.760
So the plan right now is to have the Baya Cafe open from like mid to late morning until early evening.

00:47:49.760 --> 00:47:52.239
So you could have three meals there if you wanted to.

00:47:52.239 --> 00:47:53.840
It will be somewhat limited, right?

00:47:53.840 --> 00:47:56.400
It'll be very like health forward, nutrition conscious.

00:47:56.400 --> 00:48:00.320
Um, so if that's what you're looking for, you can have all three of your meals there.

00:48:00.320 --> 00:48:05.280
Now, in addition to that, we plan to supplement the evenings with a couple different things.

00:48:05.280 --> 00:48:14.559
So one will be, you know, private chefs that you can book, you know, for a romantic couple dinner, communal private chef dinners on certain days of the week, most likely.

00:48:14.559 --> 00:48:20.000
So some days we'll have a private chef come do a communal dinner that you can opt into as one option.

00:48:20.000 --> 00:48:24.239
And then finally doing like a food cart, not food cart, food truck.

00:48:24.239 --> 00:48:24.719
There we go.

00:48:24.719 --> 00:48:32.239
Like a food truck type situation where you where it is a commercial kitchen and we're only bringing it in certain days and nights of the week.

00:48:32.239 --> 00:48:32.960
Okay.

00:48:33.280 --> 00:48:37.440
So there won't be like a fine dining dinner experience at the resort itself.

00:48:38.000 --> 00:48:40.800
So you can have dinner at the cafe.

00:48:40.800 --> 00:48:43.199
I would not call it, you know, fine dining.

00:48:43.199 --> 00:48:45.920
We're not shooting for Michelin stars or anything like that.

00:48:45.920 --> 00:48:50.800
It'll be really good food, very cool environment, but it but it's not like a fine dining restaurant.

00:48:50.800 --> 00:48:59.039
And at 20 keys, it's just really hard to make the numbers work for that unless you you have heavy foot traffic, which this area is not heavy foot traffic.

00:48:59.039 --> 00:49:00.000
It's pretty rural.

00:49:00.239 --> 00:49:00.480
Yeah.

00:49:00.639 --> 00:49:02.960
And will you guys, is there gonna be a bar?

00:49:02.960 --> 00:49:04.159
Yeah, of course.

00:49:04.159 --> 00:49:04.880
Definitely a bar.

00:49:04.880 --> 00:49:05.360
Yep.

00:49:05.360 --> 00:49:09.039
So the the cafe will will have a bar, most likely beer and wine.

00:49:09.039 --> 00:49:11.039
It's very hard to get a liquor license in this area.

00:49:11.039 --> 00:49:15.440
So we'll do beer and wine, you know, coffee drinks, smoothies, all that kind of stuff.

00:49:15.440 --> 00:49:16.159
Awesome.

00:49:16.159 --> 00:49:17.360
That is really exciting.

00:49:17.360 --> 00:49:20.320
What do you have in mind kind of for the units, for the unit style?

00:49:20.320 --> 00:49:22.159
It's a very organic shape.

00:49:22.159 --> 00:49:28.000
So, you know, from a drone view, they almost look like flower petals or you know, leaves or something like that.

00:49:28.000 --> 00:49:42.159
So it it's effectively, it has rounded walls, okay, that kind of come to a peak and it comes to like a peak point, like a leaf wood at at the top, you know, the middle of the ceiling on both the front and the back of the unit.

00:49:42.159 --> 00:49:43.920
And then it kind of dips down in the middle.

00:49:43.920 --> 00:49:51.679
So it really has this like organic flowing shape that that feels like the you know, the the flora of the era area.

00:49:51.679 --> 00:49:52.239
Wow.

00:49:52.239 --> 00:49:54.159
And when are you hoping for this to open?

00:49:54.159 --> 00:50:00.159
So the plan is to start building in Q1 of 26 and be open by Q1 of 27.

00:50:00.159 --> 00:50:03.119
So it's a it's an accelerated construction timeline.

00:50:03.119 --> 00:50:10.239
We are doing the project modular, and so that's helping us shave off a few months and and get to that 12-month schedule.

00:50:10.559 --> 00:50:12.400
Man, very exciting stuff.

00:50:12.400 --> 00:50:25.039
So, in terms of kind of macro things going on with the industry, I was just curious how in in terms of AI, how is how is AI changing how you spend your time each day?

00:50:25.039 --> 00:50:28.639
And how you, you know, how do you how do you use it on a daily basis?

00:50:28.639 --> 00:50:37.280
And how do you see it changing travel and social media?

00:50:37.280 --> 00:50:38.960
I mean, it's it's so many things, right?

00:50:38.960 --> 00:50:41.199
I mean, there's so many areas that it could impact, right?

00:50:41.199 --> 00:50:43.760
Was one is how does it impact your day as an entrepreneur?

00:50:43.760 --> 00:50:46.320
Two is how does it impact social media?

00:50:46.320 --> 00:50:50.880
And three is like, how does it impact you know operations in hospitality?

00:50:50.880 --> 00:50:52.000
I guess is the kind of the three.

00:50:52.320 --> 00:50:58.159
Well, one other thing you asked, I think is is one of the more interesting ones that I feel like I have a viewpoint on, which is how is it going to impact travel?

00:50:58.159 --> 00:51:01.360
I mean, I do feel like I have a viewpoint on that, so I'll touch on that one.

00:51:01.360 --> 00:51:06.079
In terms of my day-to-day, look, I'm I mean, I'm in and out of ChatGPT all the time.

00:51:06.079 --> 00:51:08.000
There's some use cases that it's really good for.

00:51:08.000 --> 00:51:16.480
I use ChatGPT, you know, to spin up Instagram captions, you know, in a very specific style that I like for my videos, for my personal account.

00:51:16.480 --> 00:51:27.519
I use it, you know, before I use Google now to if I'm get hopping on the phone with somebody, I want to debrief, you know, of who they are, you know, what their portfolio looks like, everything that I need to know about them.

00:51:27.519 --> 00:51:34.880
So it really helps fast track that kind of, you know, prospect or potential investor or whatever it may be, research that needs to be done.

00:51:34.880 --> 00:51:37.119
I'm now using the Chat GPT browser.

00:51:37.119 --> 00:51:46.000
So I'm I'm definitely, you know, sort of, I'd say pretty far down that rabbit hole, and it's very built into my workflow in a number of different areas.

00:51:46.000 --> 00:51:49.679
Outside of that, we use it quite a bit for content.

00:51:49.679 --> 00:51:52.239
We use it quite a bit for my personal brand content.

00:51:52.239 --> 00:52:00.719
So we still have humans that are very involved in the idea generation, topic generation, and ultimately like the final writing product.

00:52:00.719 --> 00:52:12.639
But AI helps us a ton with research, building out the story, initial iterations of what like a script for an IG reel or you know, the bones of a LinkedIn or Twitter post.

00:52:12.639 --> 00:52:16.559
So certainly leveraging it it quite a bit on that front.

00:52:16.559 --> 00:52:18.800
Yeah, those are probably the main areas.

00:52:18.800 --> 00:52:37.599
I mean, there's like, you know, it's funny, I uh just from like a personal life standpoint, I have a GPT called Peak Performance that I've built out that's helping me to, as I've kind of gotten into more of like my health and wellness biohacking journey, things, things to to learn and try and test.

00:52:37.599 --> 00:52:40.960
So I'm, you know, how to how to achieve my goals.

00:52:40.960 --> 00:52:42.400
Um I'm using ChatGPT.

00:52:42.400 --> 00:52:43.199
Give us a peek.

00:52:43.199 --> 00:52:43.840
Give us a peek.

00:52:43.840 --> 00:52:44.800
What does that look like?

00:52:44.800 --> 00:52:45.519
Sure.

00:52:45.519 --> 00:52:48.159
So I started a supplement stack earlier this year.

00:52:48.159 --> 00:52:52.239
I had never really taken supplements besides for a standard multivitamin before that.

00:52:52.239 --> 00:53:04.559
So I used ChatGPT quite a bit to research and figure out what supplements could make sense for me and and what I was you know trying to achieve, which is typically like you know, strong energy, strong recovery.

00:53:04.559 --> 00:53:14.239
You know, I did get more into fitness and working out in the last year or so, you know, trying to optimize there and then a little bit of longevity, right?

00:53:14.239 --> 00:53:17.280
So those are kind of like the main things that I'm trying to optimize for.

00:53:17.280 --> 00:53:25.360
And so yeah, I mean, I take like, I don't know, seven or eight different supplements with my morning, late morning shake now.

00:53:25.360 --> 00:53:27.440
I've I've gotten into intermittent fasting.

00:53:27.440 --> 00:53:36.480
So I'm typically not eating before 11, 11 a.m., sometimes 12, which I've found intermittent fasting, like I get amazing deep work done early in the day.

00:53:36.480 --> 00:53:38.000
I actually have great energy.

00:53:38.000 --> 00:53:42.639
I used to feel like I needed to eat first thing when I got up in the morning, and I don't feel like that anymore.

00:53:42.639 --> 00:53:46.880
And then I actually get some of my best work done on an empty stomach first thing in the morning.

00:53:46.880 --> 00:53:53.199
And yeah, so so been kind of playing with the intermittent fasting, the supplements, I get sick way less.

00:53:53.199 --> 00:53:59.760
I have young kids, so four and and one year old, and they're both in school, so tons of germs flying around.

00:53:59.760 --> 00:54:08.639
So since I've gotten into the taking supplements, focusing on my health more, I have, you know, I've I've really, you know, minimized how often I get sick.

00:54:08.639 --> 00:54:11.440
But yeah, I could tell you my full supplement stack if you want.

00:54:11.519 --> 00:54:14.880
I do a lot of like Do you drink coffee in the morning or do you are you off the coffee?

00:54:15.119 --> 00:54:16.960
I don't do coffee, I do matcha.

00:54:16.960 --> 00:54:20.079
Yeah, which matcha is really great.

00:54:20.079 --> 00:54:23.840
So coffee for me, it's not a stable energy.

00:54:23.840 --> 00:54:27.119
So I'll I'll have like massive peaks and valleys.

00:54:27.119 --> 00:54:30.480
So like I almost get like jittery if I have too much coffee, right?

00:54:30.480 --> 00:54:32.480
And so I'm unproductive at that point.

00:54:32.480 --> 00:54:34.559
And then when I crash, I have no energy.

00:54:34.559 --> 00:54:41.039
Whereas matcha has L-theanine in it, which actually helps with focus and sort of more of a calm focus.

00:54:41.039 --> 00:54:43.039
So I find matcha to be great.

00:54:43.039 --> 00:54:57.599
I also drink a lot of Celsius, which I'm not super proud of, but it's it's the most like stable energy, you know, like four or five hours long of just great peak energy without a dip that I've found.

00:54:57.599 --> 00:55:01.920
So yeah, I'd like to drink less of those, but I'm still drinking them daily at this point.

00:55:02.079 --> 00:55:03.199
All right, now I'm super interested.

00:55:03.199 --> 00:55:05.119
What's in the supplement stack?

00:55:06.639 --> 00:55:14.559
So protein, creatine, which I always thought of creatine as more of like a meathead thing, and then come to find out it really helps with mental performance.

00:55:14.559 --> 00:55:21.360
So now I take creatine, which which I never knew, collagen, collagen peptides, ashwagonda.

00:55:21.360 --> 00:55:22.800
I take this stuff, man.

00:55:22.800 --> 00:55:24.960
It's like COQ10 or something.

00:55:24.960 --> 00:55:26.239
It's because I'm on a statin.

00:55:26.239 --> 00:55:29.440
We have like high cholesterol that runs in our family, and that helps like combat that.

00:55:29.440 --> 00:55:30.480
So I take that.

00:55:30.480 --> 00:55:34.719
Pro two different types of probiotics, microvitamin plus.

00:55:34.719 --> 00:55:37.039
I think I touched on most of them.

00:55:37.039 --> 00:55:38.400
So yeah.

00:55:38.400 --> 00:55:39.679
What about fish oil?

00:55:39.840 --> 00:55:41.039
Are you are you in the fish oil?

00:55:41.199 --> 00:55:41.599
Fish oil.

00:55:41.599 --> 00:55:42.320
There's fish oil.

00:55:42.320 --> 00:55:43.840
I think there's fish oil in my microvitam.

00:55:43.840 --> 00:55:47.760
I also eat a shitload of salmon, so I probably get a good chunk that way.

00:55:47.760 --> 00:55:48.880
Oh, vitamin D.

00:55:48.880 --> 00:55:50.639
But I do I do do vitamin T D.

00:55:50.639 --> 00:55:52.960
I didn't add that one, so that's in there too.

00:55:53.280 --> 00:55:56.320
But well, uh yeah, thanks for sharing.

00:55:56.320 --> 00:55:58.400
I I I do think it's super interesting.

00:55:58.400 --> 00:56:07.519
You know, because obviously this is this is a podcast for like entrepreneurs, so I think it's it's helpful for people to get a peek into the inside of like how how they manage the work-life balance.

00:56:07.519 --> 00:56:11.599
How how have you started managing your work-life balance from your first year to like now?

00:56:11.599 --> 00:56:14.639
What's maybe the the is there any like major change?

00:56:15.039 --> 00:56:16.320
As an entrepreneur, oh yeah.

00:56:16.320 --> 00:56:23.199
When I when I first started as an entrepreneur, like, you know, no wife, no kids, like no real conception of work-life balance.

00:56:23.199 --> 00:56:25.199
I have kind of an addictive personality.

00:56:25.199 --> 00:56:29.280
So I was definitely a workaholic at points of my career.

00:56:29.280 --> 00:56:37.599
And, you know, I would I would run myself ragged working like 14 to 16 hours at a clip, and like productivity just drops off a cliff after a period of time.

00:56:37.599 --> 00:56:40.719
Like it's just not, it's counterproductive, is what I've found.

00:56:40.719 --> 00:56:46.800
So what I do now is I get up at the crack of dawn because I found like that's what works for me.

00:56:46.800 --> 00:56:53.840
I go to bed roughly with my kids, 8:30, 9 o'clock latest most nights, get up at sometime between 4 and 5 a.m.

00:56:53.840 --> 00:57:01.599
So I have a good four out, three, four hours to knock out work before most people and my family typically is up.

00:57:01.599 --> 00:57:11.199
So that I get deep work done, I get to start my day off right, meditation, electrolytes, matcha, you know, just kind of getting feeling like I'm ahead of the day before it starts.

00:57:11.199 --> 00:57:13.760
And I'm intermittent fasting, right?

00:57:13.760 --> 00:57:19.039
So I'm not eating, then get a bunch of work done, come to around like 11 or 12.

00:57:19.039 --> 00:57:24.320
Usually around 11, I'll go work out or I'll hit golf balls or something like that, some sort of reset.

00:57:24.320 --> 00:57:28.159
If I go work out, I'll do sauna and plunge typically as well.

00:57:28.159 --> 00:57:30.639
And so that's really like this reset of my day.

00:57:30.639 --> 00:57:32.320
So I almost feel like I have two days in one.

00:57:32.320 --> 00:57:34.320
So I have my 4 to 11 a.m.

00:57:34.320 --> 00:57:37.280
and then I have my like one to six.

00:57:37.280 --> 00:57:41.039
And usually in the afternoon is when I stack calls.

00:57:41.039 --> 00:57:43.679
I can usually do calls with a little bit lower energy.

00:57:43.679 --> 00:57:49.360
And earlier in the day, I try to reserve for deep work, problem solving, creativity, et cetera.

00:57:49.599 --> 00:57:52.559
Well, thanks for getting me booked in your deep work period.

00:57:52.559 --> 00:57:56.239
Um no, I I love that.

00:57:56.239 --> 00:57:59.920
I think you you actually laid out a lot of things that I've I've recently started doing.

00:57:59.920 --> 00:58:01.280
Yeah, very similar.

00:58:01.280 --> 00:58:06.079
And I love the idea of almost like two halves to the day and getting like a proper break.

00:58:06.079 --> 00:58:06.559
Yeah.

00:58:06.559 --> 00:58:08.320
I might I might try to do that more.

00:58:08.320 --> 00:58:10.639
But it's amazing if I'm trying to get up earlier.

00:58:10.639 --> 00:58:14.559
I'm actually like a naturally morning person, but just going to bed early.

00:58:14.559 --> 00:58:16.320
It's just it's all about going to bed earlier, right?

00:58:16.320 --> 00:58:16.960
That's where it starts.

00:58:17.440 --> 00:58:17.760
100%.

00:58:17.760 --> 00:58:19.199
Yeah, it's all about going to bed earlier.

00:58:19.199 --> 00:58:24.719
I got an aura ring recently and I found that like almost all of my deep sleep happens before 1 a.m.

00:58:25.119 --> 00:58:26.719
So that happened, yeah.

00:58:26.719 --> 00:58:27.760
That is totally what happened.

00:58:27.760 --> 00:58:33.760
Like, once I get to now, I don't know if this is just me getting older, but like once I get to 3 a.m., I just am barely sleeping.

00:58:33.760 --> 00:58:35.360
So it's it's yeah.

00:58:35.360 --> 00:58:36.719
So I'm with you.

00:58:36.719 --> 00:58:37.599
I'm with you.

00:58:37.599 --> 00:58:40.159
And all right.

00:58:40.159 --> 00:58:43.119
I want to maybe like wrap things up here.

00:58:43.119 --> 00:58:48.159
This is so what's what's the five-year plan, like five to ten year plan for you, Ben?

00:58:49.119 --> 00:58:51.599
Yeah, I I increasingly get this question.

00:58:51.599 --> 00:58:57.760
So I don't know if it's because I have too much going on or people don't really understand or what, but I I often I get this question a lot.

00:58:57.760 --> 00:58:59.119
Like, where where am I headed?

00:58:59.119 --> 00:59:00.239
What's the plan?

00:59:00.239 --> 00:59:12.480
So the the plan is to have the best in class marketing and revenue management firm for hotels and resorts with a focus on boutique, upscale, experiential properties, right?

00:59:12.480 --> 00:59:13.760
That's what I believe the future is.

00:59:13.760 --> 00:59:15.280
That's who I want our clients to be.

00:59:15.280 --> 00:59:22.719
So that's on the AWASI side of things, to continue to develop these one-of-a-kind properties, right?

00:59:22.719 --> 00:59:29.039
That that are viral, that the modern traveler loves, and really to grow the buyer brand.

00:59:29.039 --> 00:59:32.639
Now, I will say that like capital markets are still challenging.

00:59:32.639 --> 00:59:33.679
It's hard to raise money.

00:59:33.679 --> 00:59:41.920
So, my goal is to continue to knock out what I consider these singles and doubles, smaller to mid-sized projects, continue to stack successes, continue to learn.

00:59:41.920 --> 00:59:56.719
And then when the capital markets open up, which is hopefully in the near future, raise a big front, big fund around this thesis of experiential hospitality, travel, taking everything I've learned and sort of doing it at a bigger scale.

00:59:56.719 --> 00:59:59.760
So the goal is keep stacking wins and really positioning.

00:59:59.760 --> 01:00:05.920
Myself to be in a spot that we can raise quite a bit of capital when the market is primed for that.

01:00:05.920 --> 01:00:07.119
So that's the goal.

01:00:07.440 --> 01:00:07.920
Amazing.

01:00:07.920 --> 01:00:08.559
Amazing.

01:00:08.559 --> 01:00:12.880
Any last kind of thoughts or insights, comments, or anything for the audience?

01:00:12.880 --> 01:00:14.559
It's a good question.

01:00:15.119 --> 01:00:22.800
You know, I get a lot of people hitting me up that are kind of in like their earlier stage, trying to partner, trying to pick my brain, all that kind of stuff.

01:00:22.800 --> 01:00:25.440
And I would definitely say like hop on the hop on my newsletter.

01:00:25.440 --> 01:00:27.519
I give a ton of value in my newsletter every week.

01:00:27.519 --> 01:00:30.719
So you can find me on LinkedIn, Ben Wolf2Fs.

01:00:30.719 --> 01:00:33.920
There's a link to my newsletter there, ramping up my Instagram quite a bit.

01:00:33.920 --> 01:00:35.039
I am Ben Wolf.

01:00:35.039 --> 01:00:36.960
My newsletter is there also.

01:00:36.960 --> 01:00:39.119
So a lot of information there.

01:00:39.119 --> 01:00:41.199
I'm considering launching a mastermind.

01:00:41.199 --> 01:00:47.039
So if you're interested in that, let me know, sort of building out a list and seeing if we want to move forward with that next year.

01:00:47.039 --> 01:01:03.440
But my my main advice is like do stuff, try stuff, learn what you can from me, from Isaac, from all these other Travis Chambers, all these people in the space, and like have some initial traction, have something to show for before you start reaching out and trying to partner or pick somebody's brain.

01:01:03.440 --> 01:01:13.840
Like have actually done something or show that you've done something and tried things and maybe failed and learned before, you know, just trying to pull in partners and get people to engage with you.

01:01:13.840 --> 01:01:17.360
Because, you know, I've always found it's much harder to do that.

01:01:17.360 --> 01:01:24.880
And folks that are farther along in the journey won't take you as seriously if like you just have a kind of pie in the sky idea and come off as a dreamer.

01:01:24.880 --> 01:01:36.079
So actually have executed something, even if it's on a smaller scale, one unit, two units, like show me what you've actually done and not this dream that you have of what you want to build on these 30 acres that you haven't even bought yet.

01:01:36.400 --> 01:01:36.880
Yeah.

01:01:36.880 --> 01:01:38.000
That's yes.

01:01:38.159 --> 01:01:38.400
Yeah.

01:01:38.400 --> 01:01:39.199
What do you think?

01:01:39.199 --> 01:01:40.079
Is that good?

01:01:40.400 --> 01:01:41.519
No, I think that's perfect.

01:01:41.519 --> 01:01:43.440
I was gonna, and it sounds like you got your ask in.

01:01:43.440 --> 01:01:45.280
So that was your ask for the audience, I take it.

01:01:45.280 --> 01:01:45.840
Perfect.

01:01:45.840 --> 01:01:48.239
Well, I I totally agree, Ben.

01:01:48.239 --> 01:01:51.039
What an insight-packed show.

01:01:51.039 --> 01:01:53.840
And I definitely recommend for anyone listening to check out your newsletter.

01:01:53.840 --> 01:01:54.559
I've really enjoyed it.

01:01:54.559 --> 01:01:55.440
Follow you on LinkedIn.

01:01:55.440 --> 01:01:57.280
You do some great posts on LinkedIn as well.

01:01:57.280 --> 01:01:59.119
Some really terrific insights.

01:01:59.119 --> 01:02:05.440
I'm very excited to see Baya come to life, and I'm excited to see the expansion at Fredericksburg as well.

01:02:05.440 --> 01:02:08.079
So look forward to continuing to follow the follow the journey.

01:02:08.079 --> 01:02:09.199
Ben, thanks for coming on.

01:02:09.199 --> 01:02:09.920
Yeah, man.

01:02:09.920 --> 01:02:10.800
Let me know when you're in town.

01:02:10.800 --> 01:02:11.840
Happy to host you.

01:02:11.840 --> 01:02:13.199
Yes, we'll do